NOW I KNOW...

1st I need to apologize to folks in community and others who I thought were whining cheaters when discussing core knowledge questions.  I mean how hard can 4 ccna level questions be?  Well NOW I KNOW...yesterday was a bad day

NOW I KNOW...You can walk out of the LAB feeling like a champion only to be defeated by a technicality

NOW I KNOW....why everyone is pissed about the core knowledge questions

NOW I KNOW.... that the core knowledge is not necessarily CCNA level questions, nor NP level. (1st time 2-3 of my question were awkwardly worded but CCNA level, Yesterday only 1 of the topics/answers can be found in the "Official CCNA Exam Certification Guides" 

NOW I KNOW...the entire "expanded" blueprint is considered "core"

NOW I KNOW...that the answers must be completely and totally subjective

NOW I KNOW...that the Core Knowledge questions are poorly worded and/or vague

NOW I KNOW...that you can't ask the procter for clarification but they can ask the canididate. (10-15 mins after finishing the core knowledge the proctor asked me how I interpreted question #2.  Maybe he looked at my answer and saw that I misinterpreted question but more likely it was just poorly worded and he wasn't sure of the answer either)

NOW I KNOW...that I can overcome adversity (I was given the wrong lab and had to start over an 30mins in) and still crush the lab (69 or 79 points)

NOW I KNOW...that you really need to slow  down read and reread and reread the core knowledge questions.

I don't know...what a well prepared canidate is ( I know it is not someone with 13 years of IP Networking experience, over 1000 hours of study in the last 6 months, its not someone who tried to do understand the technologies not just pass a test, its not some who refused to look at questionable material. 

At this point I am not willingly to shell out another $1400 (+ $250 airfare + $300 hotel + $100 rental car + $$food + 100's more hours) on a crap shoot.

NOW I KNOW..I am just not sure I care!  Thanks for letting me vent.

 

Comments

  • Dude!  Sorry to hear it went that way for you.  It sure sounds weird that the proctor asked you about one of the Core Knowledge (CK) questions, particularly after you were into the configuration portion of the lab...

    Have you seen INE's CK prep tool?  Does it resemble anything at all of the two rounds of questions you've seen?

    I haven't seen the real deal yet, but I'm certainly apprehensive about it since I'll be shelling out $1400.00 of my own money.

    Seems lots of folks are opening tickets with Cisco Cert. Support on this -- from what everyone is saying you should probably do that too.  Good luck!!!

  • I used the INE tool pretty much everyday since it was released a month or so ago.  The CK prep tool was great for me because it really helped organize lots of info for quick recall (It also provided great repetition as when I missed something I would usually read 10-15 minutes on that topic) which I think help a lot during both the real lab and Mock labs. 

    As for using the tool to prep for the CK section, I am not sure.  For one  thing the questions and answers are typically longer on the actual exam. I didn't feel like any of the actual questions could be answered in a word or two. So training yourself to answer quick hitting binary questions may not be the best strategy but what are your of other options?  somebody else said reread you ccna books, I submitted myself to that torture as well and it was truly a waste of time.  Maybe reread your CCNP books but still your only 50% there.

    The next thing that I would say is that INE needs to continue to expand the CK tool's database as I don't believe it covers all the blueprint yet. 

    Lastly, I would say that the INE question are pretty straight forward and that 25-50%  of actual exam question (keep in mind, I've only seen 8 questions plus the 2 samples) are vague and/or awkward.  Which is what I meant by slowing down and paying attention whereas I think the quizzers train you to speed up.  I actually worked the lab section considerable slower yesterday than in any practice labs.  4 or 5 times yesterday on the 3rd, 4th or 5th read of a task I realized that may gut reaction was off.

    But at this point I am highly confused, emotionally drained and really second guessing everything.  If I do a 3rd attempt, I would still use the INE ck tool.  I think is valuable if not exactly for the intended purpose.  But that is where I am at this point.  I am hesitant to sign up again because I really have know idea how to prepare for the questions.  One of the best resources that I used was packetlife protocol overviews http://packetlife.net/cheatsheets/. But once again the questions are not exactly theory they kinda of have a more practical bend to them.  Given this diagram what would happen...given this configuration what would happen...why does x do y?  Think about the OPSF ABR Core Knowledge sample question that Cisco released a few weeks ago (or even the IPv6 question).

    So I have typed a lot to say I really don't know how I would prepare for the Core Knowledge section next time.

     












  • I agree with your assessment of the Core Knowledge section
    (after seeing it in two attempts) in that Cisco appears to be angling for some
    level of practical assessment of  your knowledge as opposed to a simple
    regurgitation of memorized tech trivia like all the other Cisco written exams I
    have taken.   These questions were responsible for my undoing in my first
    attempt.  I too found it difficult to focus my efforts to study for them in the
    interim between my two attempts because of this slant to the questions.  I did
    maybe around 40 hours of book study during this time, but in the end I did not
    have any questions that I got right because of this book study.

     

    I am encouraged by Cisco’s attempt protect the integrity of the
    exam – albeit a little misguided in my view.  Its just the latest chapter in an
    arms race between the brain dumpers and Cisco.  A more fundamental change to
    the exam is going to be necessary in my opinion to be sure that everyone
    branded an expert by Cisco actually is one.

     

    I like the idea of an actual verification of industry experience
    as well as a closely proctored initial troubleshooting section that must be
    passed to see the configuration aspects of the exam.  The difference between
    this type of troubleshooting and the second day troubleshooting of the old
    iteration of the exam is that in this case you are pitched in to a network you
    did not build yourself and you will need to quickly assess it’s nuances in
    order to pass.  The down side to this approach is that it increases the
    subjectivity of the grading of the exam.

     

    -Steve

     

    From:
    [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of johnthom1865

    Sent: Friday, April 17, 2009 12:41 PM

    To: Steve Nowell (snowell)

    Subject: Re: [CCIE R&S General] NOW I KNOW...

     

    I used the INE tool pretty much everyday since it was released a month or so
    ago.  The CK prep tool was great for me because it really
    helped organize lots of info for quick recall (It also
    provided great repetition as when I missed something I would usually read 10-15
    minutes on that topic) which I think help a lot during both the real lab
    and Mock labs. 

    As for using the tool to prep for the CK section, I am not
    sure.  For one  thing the questions and answers are
    typically longer on the actual exam. I didn't feel like any of the
    actual questions could be answered in a word or two. So training yourself to
    answer quick hitting binary questions may not be the best strategy but what are
    your of other options?  somebody else said reread you ccna books, I submitted
    myself to that torture as well and it was truly a waste of time.  Maybe
    reread your CCNP books but still your only 50% there.

    The next thing that I would say is that INE needs to continue to expand the
    CK tool's database as I don't believe it covers all the blueprint yet. 

    Lastly, I would say that the INE question are pretty straight forward and
    that 25-50%  of actual exam question (keep in mind, I've
    only seen 8 questions plus the 2 samples) are vague and/or awkward.  Which
    is what I meant by slowing down and paying attention whereas I think the
    quizzers train you to speed up.  I actually worked the lab section
    considerable slower yesterday than in any practice labs.  4 or 5 times
    yesterday on the 3rd, 4th or 5th read of a task I realized that may
    gut reaction was off.

    But at this point I am highly confused, emotionally drained and really
    second guessing everything.  If I do a 3rd attempt, I would still use
    the INE ck tool.  I think is valuable if not exactly for the intended
    purpose.  But that is where I am at this point.  I am hesitant to
    sign up again because I really have know idea how to prepare for the
    questions.  One of the best resources that I used was packetlife
    protocol overviews http://packetlife.net/cheatsheets/. But
    once again the questions are not exactly theory they kinda of have a more
    practical bend to them.  Given this diagram what would happen...given this
    configuration what would happen...why does x do y?  Think about the OPSF
    ABR Core Knowledge sample question that Cisco released a few weeks ago (or even
    the IPv6 question).

    So I have typed a lot to say I really don't know how I would prepare for the
    Core Knowledge section next time.

     







    Internetwork Expert - The Industry Leader in CCIE Preparation

    http://www.internetworkexpert.com



    Subscription information may be found at:

    http://www.ieoc.com/forums/ForumSubscriptions.aspx





  • Hi Johnthom,

    Sorry to hear from you but don't stop trying again. Few of my freinds advised me  refering to BSCI,BCMSN and ONT quick reference sheet for CK. If you need this reference sheet then please unicast me.

     

  • Thanks for the feedback everyone - we will be creating better and more vague :-) questions all the time.

     

    Also - we will cover EVERY possible topic domain. 

     

    Thanks again! 

  • johnthom1865,

    I also sat my lab on the 16th April and I know exactly how you feel.  I've put in the hours, the money and can't see me shelling out for another attempt after the experience I had at the lab. On the point about prepareing for the Core knowledge questions. I also felt that the questions were of a CCNA level but I don't feel that you can really prepare from reading books and doing tests. The questions were more here's an ouput, what does it mean? I would say that my knowledge for these questions came from everyday troubleshooting at work and that's the point I suppose.

  • Sorry to hear mate, it sucks so much how people who can smash the practical lab feel like they are gambling $1400 on 4 trivia questions where they have no access to the documentation or the proctor.

    Its against the spirit of the whole lab exam :/

  • It's not designed to be trivia questions.  It's designed to test a level of functional knowledge.

    Are there things that seem trivial?  I'm sure there are, as it depends on what your focus area happens to be.  As an example, I don't run EIGRP on real-life networks.  So when it comes to the written exam (recert for me) I think there's WAY too many EIGRP questions asking me about things I don't really care about.

    Yet.  I still have to know that stuff.

    It's all about perspective.

    Scott







    ----- Original Message -----
    From: "Nimmers" <[email protected]>
    Sent: Sun, April 19, 2009 6:14
    Subject: Re: [CCIE R&S General] NOW I KNOW...


    Sorry to hear mate, it sucks so much how people who can smash the practical lab feel like they are gambling $1400 on 4 trivia questions where they have no access to the documentation or the proctor.

    Its against the spirit of the whole lab exam :/



    --
    View this message online at: http://ieoc.com/forums/p/6079/21236.aspx#21236
    --
    Internetwork Expert - The Industry Leader in CCIE Preparation

    http://www.internetworkexpert.com



    Subscription information may be found at:

    http://www.ieoc.com/forums/ForumSubscriptions.aspx
    <!>

  • can I know why you don't run EIGRP on real networks? our Cisco reps push it hard, pitch us the bullet points we've always heard, and I still feel like its Cisco propaganda sometimes. I mean, the Department of Defense runs OSPF, and if people say its because we also have foundry switches, they're full of ________ . There's other reasons behind it, but way above my pay grade


    On Sun, Apr 19, 2009 at 5:49 PM, Scott Morris <[email protected]> wrote:

    It's not designed to be trivia questions.  It's designed to test a level of functional knowledge.

    Are there things that seem trivial?  I'm sure there are, as it depends on what your focus area happens to be.  As an example, I don't run EIGRP on real-life networks.  So when it comes to the written exam (recert for me) I think there's WAY too many EIGRP questions asking me about things I don't really care about.


    Yet.  I still have to know that stuff.

    It's all about perspective.

    Scott







    ----- Original Message -----
    From: "Nimmers" <[email protected]>
    Sent: Sun, April 19, 2009 6:14
    Subject: Re: [CCIE R&S General] NOW I KNOW...



    Sorry to hear mate, it sucks so much how people who can smash the practical lab feel like they are gambling $1400 on 4 trivia questions where they have no access to the documentation or the proctor.

    Its against the spirit of the whole lab exam :/



    --
    View this message online at: http://ieoc.com/forums/p/6079/21236.aspx#21236

    --
    Internetwork Expert - The Industry Leader in CCIE Preparation

    http://www.internetworkexpert.com



    Subscription information may be found at:

    http://www.ieoc.com/forums/ForumSubscriptions.aspx






    Internetwork Expert - The Industry Leader in CCIE Preparation

    http://www.internetworkexpert.com



    Subscription information may be found at:

    http://www.ieoc.com/forums/ForumSubscriptions.aspx

  • There are lots of reasons to run one over the other, but mostly it depends on your network structure.

    I don't have any hatred for EIGRP.  In small flat networks, it takes much of the thinking away from configuration which is a wonderful thing!  Most of the networks I work on are either larger networks and/or service provider networks, so there are different requirements.

    in the SP world, with MPLS, the traffic engineering is the primary reason for OSPF.  But others, it just varies.

    DoD most likely runs an open standard routing protocol so that they can appear unbiased in terms of asking/awarding contracts.  Even if they choose Cisco all the time, other companies would more easily be able to sue and claim discrimination if a proprietary routing protocol was indeed used.

    HTH,

    Scott







    ----- Original Message -----
    From: "luisgarcia" <[email protected]>
    Sent: Sun, April 19, 2009 12:44
    Subject: Re: [CCIE R&S General] NOW I KNOW...



    can I know why you don't run EIGRP on real networks? our Cisco reps push it hard, pitch us the bullet points we've always heard, and I still feel like its Cisco propaganda sometimes. I mean, the Department of Defense runs OSPF, and if people say its because we also have foundry switches, they're full of ________ . There's other reasons behind it, but way above my pay grade


    On Sun, Apr 19, 2009 at 5:49 PM, Scott Morris <[email protected]> wrote:

    It's not designed to be trivia questions.  It's designed to test a level of functional knowledge.

    Are there things that seem trivial?  I'm sure there are, as it depends on what your focus area happens to be.  As an example, I don't run EIGRP on real-life networks.  So when it comes to the written exam (recert for me) I think there's WAY too many EIGRP questions asking me about things I don't really care about.


    Yet.  I still have to know that stuff.

    It's all about perspective.

    Scott







    ----- Original Message -----
    From: "Nimmers" <[email protected]>
    Sent: Sun, April 19, 2009 6:14
    Subject: Re: [CCIE R&S General] NOW I KNOW...



    Sorry to hear mate, it sucks so much how people who can smash the practical lab feel like they are gambling $1400 on 4 trivia questions where they have no access to the documentation or the proctor.

    Its against the spirit of the whole lab exam :/



    --
    View this message online at: http://ieoc.com/forums/p/6079/21236.aspx#21236

    --
    Internetwork Expert - The Industry Leader in CCIE Preparation

    http://www.internetworkexpert.com



    Subscription information may be found at:

    http://www.ieoc.com/forums/ForumSubscriptions.aspx






    Internetwork Expert - The Industry Leader in CCIE Preparation

    http://www.internetworkexpert.com



    Subscription information may be found at:

    http://www.ieoc.com/forums/ForumSubscriptions.aspx



    --
    View this message online at: http://ieoc.com/forums/p/6079/21255.aspx#21255
    --
    Internetwork Expert - The Industry Leader in CCIE Preparation

    http://www.internetworkexpert.com



    Subscription information may be found at:

    http://www.ieoc.com/forums/ForumSubscriptions.aspx
    <!>

  • Thats the general thought in this office anyway, thx for the comments!


    On Sun, Apr 19, 2009 at 9:19 PM, Scott Morris <[email protected]> wrote:
    There are lots of reasons to run one over the other, but mostly it depends on your network structure.


    I don't have any hatred for EIGRP.  In small flat networks, it takes much of the thinking away from configuration which is a wonderful thing!  Most of the networks I work on are either larger networks and/or service provider networks, so there are different requirements.


    in the SP world, with MPLS, the traffic engineering is the primary reason for OSPF.  But others, it just varies.

    DoD most likely runs an open standard routing protocol so that they can appear unbiased in terms of asking/awarding contracts.  Even if they choose Cisco all the time, other companies would more easily be able to sue and claim discrimination if a proprietary routing protocol was indeed used.


    HTH,

    Scott







    ----- Original Message -----
    From: "luisgarcia" <[email protected]>
    Sent: Sun, April 19, 2009 12:44

    Subject: Re: [CCIE R&S General] NOW I KNOW...





    can I know why you don't run EIGRP on real networks? our Cisco reps push it hard, pitch us the bullet points we've always heard, and I still feel like its Cisco propaganda sometimes. I mean, the Department of Defense runs OSPF, and if people say its because we also have foundry switches, they're full of ________ . There's other reasons behind it, but way above my pay grade



    On Sun, Apr 19, 2009 at 5:49 PM, Scott Morris <[email protected]> wrote:
    It's not designed to be trivia questions.  It's designed to test a level of functional knowledge.

    Are there things that seem trivial?  I'm sure there are, as it depends on what your focus area happens to be.  As an example, I don't run EIGRP on real-life networks.  So when it comes to the written exam (recert for me) I think there's WAY too many EIGRP questions asking me about things I don't really care about.


    Yet.  I still have to know that stuff.

    It's all about perspective.

    Scott




    ----- Original Message -----
    From: "Nimmers" <[email protected]>
    Sent: Sun, April 19, 2009 6:14
    Subject: Re: [CCIE R&S General] NOW I KNOW...



    Sorry to hear mate, it sucks so much how people who can smash the practical lab feel like they are gambling $1400 on 4 trivia questions where they have no access to the documentation or the proctor.

    Its against the spirit of the whole lab exam :/



    --
    View this message online at: http://ieoc.com/forums/p/6079/21236.aspx#21236
    --
    Internetwork Expert - The Industry Leader in CCIE Preparation

    http://www.internetworkexpert.com

    Subscription information may be found at:
    http://www.ieoc.com/forums/ForumSubscriptions.aspx





    Internetwork Expert - The Industry Leader in CCIE Preparation
    http://www.internetworkexpert.com

    Subscription information may be found at:

    http://www.ieoc.com/forums/ForumSubscriptions.aspx




    --
    View this message online at: http://ieoc.com/forums/p/6079/21255.aspx#21255

    --
    Internetwork Expert - The Industry Leader in CCIE Preparation
    http://www.internetworkexpert.com

    Subscription information may be found at:

    http://www.ieoc.com/forums/ForumSubscriptions.aspx




    Internetwork Expert - The Industry Leader in CCIE Preparation
    http://www.internetworkexpert.com

    Subscription information may be found at:

    http://www.ieoc.com/forums/ForumSubscriptions.aspx

Sign In or Register to comment.